Why do we let the Iraqis promote killing US soldiers?

[natedogg42]

I was watching the news this morning...and it isn't the first time i've seen something like this but, a bunch of ragheads were dancing around a burned out humvee holding a charred helmet and shouting death to america...yadda yadda yadda

Meanwhile, 100 feet behind them, there is an M-1 Abrams just sitting there turning the turret, keeping an eye on them....dunno about you guys but I think that situation is almost worth a court martial....I would have loved to see nothing more than 3 MGs on that fucker rip to crowd to pieces and/or smear their body parts into the road with its tracks....but thats just me.

What a bunch of ungrateful cocksuckers.

[David Allen]

Don't believe everything your watch in the news. Remember, newspapers and stations like Fox News, etc are businesses. Reporting schools being built and grateful Iraqis does not sell. Reporting Americans being killed sells...

Sick isn't it!

[grnberet12]

Poe hit the nail on the head...Why is that we dont hear about all the good things that we are doing over there? Because its more interesting and has a lot more influence on Americans showing all the bad that happens everyday. That is why I hate the media being involved so heavily with the military!

[David Allen]

A scene from We Were Soldiers pops into mind. Just after the battle ends and the reporters arrive and well...act like reporters.

Again, it makes me sick...

[alexif]

the whole "raghead" and indiscriminately killing a crowd of people thing only bothers me?

i mean, the situation sucks, but we're supposed to be civilized and contained, not racist and barbaric.

[roger29]

Yeah, it's only you dude...I think you set yourself up for the wrong line of work...unless of course you are going OD or AG.

Isn't war by nature barbaric? I say hell yeah!

[natedogg42]

OK, for all we know those tards just ripped the helmet off a burnt US soldier, why wouldn't a responsible commander want his ment to get rid of the enemy as they lay exposed before his/her eyes? Barring higher orders and everything it would be much more logical, opposed to letting the same crowd come back later in the day with their AK-47/RPG/IED combo....

And GODDAMNIT alexif stfu about your racism charges, they did have rags on their heads and if we were doing this in @#%^ing NORWAY I would have WANTED the crowd to get a USAF courtesy napalm shower, I dont give a shit about the color of someone's skin, get a life douchebag.

And who the @#$! said anything about indescriminently killing a crowd? I thought it was clear that I wanted to be thoroughly descriminatory about that based upon their actions.

Yeah we're supposed to be "civilized" and not "racist and barbaric" (racist my left nut). Barbaric is very relative and left to one's personal opinion, I personally believe that killing the people that have essentially freed you (these were shiites hence chanting "Sadr") is barbaric, taking out the trash is more like a chore...

Alexif Fuck You.
I've read all 2 of your posts and there's not too much difference between the two. You call me a racist, and you call CDTHardass a racist....good job you fucking sack of @#$%. I hope your proud...with any luck, your failure to conform to the weight standards will have you out of army rotc in no time flat.

[Holt]

natedogg, calm down, your response to alexif isnt that much better than his accusations, harsh and baseless as they are. It still aint right to say that stuff in an open forumn like this.
BTW, i like the norway bit, really illustrates the issue.

[roger29]

Natedogg, I like it, even though you're airforce! This ain't an open forum here, it's our place to fucking state our opinions! Nate, you are correct, and you should find alex and beat him with a spatula!

[Gambit]

*ranting and raving*

Man, grow up. You are exhibiting exactly 0 leadership qualities by letting your anger control you, not to mention looking extremely unprofessional. If you can learn how to express your disagreement in a calm manner, you'll get yourself a lot further in life (military or otherwise)... right now I'd only be happy with you being a no-rank infantry soldier.


This ain't an open forum here, it's our place to fucking state our opinions!

Hmmm... so that whole thing about anybody being able to sign up and post... wait, how is it not an open forum? Of all people, roger, you should know well enough to not fan the flames.

[natedogg42]

You are exhibiting exactly 0 leadership qualities by letting your anger control you, not to mention looking extremely unprofessional.
While I respect your opinion gambit, I was/am not attempting to display leadership qualities and I don't care about appearing "professional" at this juncture. Just because I am upset over/at something doesn't mean "anger" is controlling me. I wouldn't accuse Alexif of being controlled by stupidity or you of being controlled by calmness. Furthermore, it would be unprofessional of a leader to allow something like the act I described at the top of the post to occur. It would be unprofessional not to be decisive, and to demonstrate to the target audience (those individuals wearing dirty articles of clothing upon the vertex of their collective craniums but however should not be referred to as "ragheads") that their behavior will not be tolerated. I'm not blaming the Lt. or Cpt. in charge, I am critisizing the policy set forth from above.


If you can learn how to express your disagreement in a calm manner, you'll get yourself a lot further in life (military or otherwise)...

No doubt, bud. If I were argueing the above position with somebody that actually knew me in person and was having a face to face with he/she, I probably wouldn't have put things so bluntly. However, in the interest of saving time and not having to produce a novel written in "diplomacy." I just went ahead and said things how they are. While discussions of socio-economic/religious/cultural/ethnic differences and our sensitivities toward such is no doubt fastenating to some, I just didn't think that they were necessary to include simply in the interest of allowing a wider range of audience partake in the understanding of my opinion.


right now I'd only be happy with you being a no-rank infantry soldier.

Wow, man, let's not let anger grab control of ourselves. Seriously though, can't we all just get along?

Oh and one more thing ...

thank god you're going to be an army officer. the army needs more idiot racists.

While your sarcasm is no doubt fascinating to everyone, are you implying that the army is full of idiots and racists? If so, please explain yourself.

[TheTokenGook]

Everybody just chill. Just be glad that I decided not to delete these posts. Use this so all of us can learn something and calm down in the future. State your opinions, but don't get too personal.

[alexif]

There is a difference between barbarism and war. Like killing out of necessity, not out of spite and anger. killing for tactical reasons, not to mow down "ragheads" who piss you off with their "yadda yadda yadda" chanting.

The reason it would be against higher orders is they posed no immediate threat to the tanker crew, nor were they responsible for the attack. It's called the laws of land warfare, rules of engagement, the geneva convention, and we respect those rules and live by them because without them we would be nothing but the vicious, mindless, racist killers you want us to be.

Thank for your confirming that they did, indeed, have rags on their heads, so it's acceptable to call them "ragheads". My bad.

So because they are protesting against an invading army, they should all be killed? They should either like it or die? Keep in mind, this crowd was NOT the crowd that attacked the vehicle. This is a protesting crowd. So because their views are anti-America, we should kill them?

Yes, I do call you both racists, because that's what you are. A racist slur is a racist slur, whether or not we happen to be fighting them or not.

Yes, I should be beaten because I think it's wrong to kill innocent protestors and yes, because I am opposed to that, I clearly am unable to pass army height / weight standards.

And yes, the Army is full of racist idiots. Surprise! I'm not white. I love the Army and I love my nation, but guess what, this post has done nothing but confirm those opinions. Most of all, now I know I don't need to waste my time on this forum. thank you for confirming all the typical army stereotypes.

i expected at least one person to have a problem with "raghead" getting thrown out there, and the prospect of firing into a protesting crowd. but no one sees anything wrong with either of those things wrong, so clearly this is not the place for me.

see you in the army!

[Gambit]

I second TG's post.

alexif and natedogg, the posts above are more like what I'd expect out of future officers. See I knew you could do it. ;)

Seriously... nate, I'd caution you about venting in public... I know waaaay to many people who have gotten in deep shit because of e-mails/posts that they have written but "not expected to get to X" (insert authority of choice here). Just a thought.

alexif, I'd cruise around AIFA a little bit more before posting, but don't leave us quite yet. I think you'll find that by and large we're pretty rational, open-minded individuals, but clearly type-A's... and you're not helping your case by dropping one-liners that are entirely comprised of personal attacks. If you post your opinions on issues without personally attacking other people, you'll get a lot better responses. And be careful in the Army, you won't find a whole lot of people that have problems calling the enemy "ragheads", "hajis", "gooks"... you name it. It's actually good for things--if soldiers can de-humanize the enemy into a racial slur, they are more likely to do their job when the shit hits the fan. I mean really, what good does it do for your average 11-B to be thinking about the wife and kids of the guy he just shot? We'd have an army full of concienscious objectors. And that... well, it really wouldn't have much of a point, eh?

[natedogg42]

There is a difference between barbarism and war. Like killing out of necessity, not out of spite and anger.

OK, lets say you're patrolling in a neighborhood in Baghdad (just keeping the peace) and a [not raghead] just pulled an AK-47 out from under his [not rags] and shot your buddy in the face, dropped his gun and run, you would not put carefully aim your M-16 and penetrate his [not rags] or aim a little higher and put commence operation "5.56mm out the face" into effect?


killing for tactical reasons, not to mow down "ragheads" who piss you off with their "yadda yadda yadda" chanting.

First of all, the first word of a sentence is capitalized. Secondly, I did not say "yadda yadda yadda" as a reference to their languade. "Yadda yadda yadda" is commonly used in the English language to suppliment the abbreviation "etc." Perhaps if you weren't so eager to claim racism you would have realized this before you posted.


It's called the laws of land warfare, rules of engagement, the geneva convention, and we respect those rules and live by them because without them we would be nothing but the vicious, mindless, racist killers you want us to be.

First of all, who said anything about being mindless? It takes brains to figure out the best way to go about killing those guys. Racist? *UGH* Please refer to previous posts by many of the fine AIFA users. Vicious? Hell yes. Desperate times call for desperate measures sweetheart. Sometimes you've just got to suck it up, realize what needs to be done, and do it. As Roger said previously... War is hell. A prospective Army officer should know this. If our army made its decisions based upon whether or not it would be considered "vicious" we would be ineffective, have let our country down, and not to mention joined the ranks of most of the European Union as the military laughing stocks of the world. Would it be too vicious to put a Hellfire missile through Osama's @$$?


Thank for your confirming that they did, indeed, have rags on their heads, so it's acceptable to call them "ragheads". My bad.

Apology accepted.


So because they are protesting against an invading army, they should all be killed? They should either like it or die? Keep in mind, this crowd was NOT the crowd that attacked the vehicle. This is a protesting crowd. So because their views are anti-America, we should kill them?


Invading army? I take it the junior senator (D-MA) can expect your vote. They weren't the crowd that attacked the vehicles? Well the vehicles were damaged when they parked outside of a building that COALITION forces were entering because it being used to manufacture weapons for the insurgents/terrorists/or in your case freedom fighters. A massive IED was detonated as US troops entered, killing at least 3. How do I know the crowd didn't know the bomb was there? Protesting? They were celebrating. Kill them for behing anti-American? Please, I didn't say "BLOW UP THE UN" who cares if they're anti-American.


Yes, I do call you both racists, because that's what you are. A racist slur is a racist slur, whether or not we happen to be fighting them or not.

Excuse me but I don't believe you can find a "racist slur" by even your standards in CDTHardass's post. I've had friends in the past and currently who are of Asian, Arab, African, European, Indian,"Native American" and probably someone that I've left off descent. So you can leave that race card crap at the door. Never once have I advocated differential treatment to anybody based upon skin pigmentation or other COSMETIC features, all men (and women) are born equal. Some choose to become inferior based upon their actions, right ALEXIF?


Yes, I should be beaten because I think it's wrong to kill innocent protestors and yes, because I am opposed to that, I clearly am unable to pass army height / weight standards.

No, you misunderstand me. You are unable to pass your height/weight standards because the number on the scale says so. (Token I love you...please don't delete these posts, it's all in good fun, no one has to continue reading...)


And yes, the Army is full of racist idiots. Surprise! I'm not white. I love the Army and I love my nation, but guess what, this post has done nothing but confirm those opinions. Most of all, now I know I don't need to waste my time on this forum. thank you for confirming all the typical army stereotypes.

You love the Army and your nation? Then for God's sake, act like it dude. I don't care what color you are, all I see black words on gray background. Well man, I'm not in the Army so please don't let my viewpoints/fact get in the way of your opinions. Don't you see that little Air Force symbol to the upper lefthand of your screen? The only Army stereotype I've heard is that Army people are dumb. After reading the different posts on AIFA and reading what I have written thoroughly, I am sure you would not accept that stereotype as fact. Also, if you take the opinions of one or even a handful of people and use that experience to judge the whole group by, are you not infact becoming prejudiced and creating a stereotype of your own?


i expected at least one person to have a problem with "raghead" getting thrown out there, and the prospect of firing into a protesting crowd. but no one sees anything wrong with either of those things wrong, so clearly this is not the place for me.

Just because you're not politically correct does not mean that you're a racist. An educated or intelligent person should be able to distinguish the difference. I feel sorry for you if you go through life not being able to take a joke or accept a different strategy of articulating opinions. You need to lighten up bro. What do you think about Alexif consistantly attempting to link a word he doesn't like with "racism" tokenGOOK?

This has been fun. It's nice to be able to vent through education of others as opposed to *WARNING JOKE* burning down that black people's houses?*/WARNING JOKE*

[natedogg42]

I'm trying to excersize my ability to speak more diplomatically TG, and therefore you are doing a great disservice to myself, future victims of my posting, and future members of our Army and therefore our country if you delete these posts. Furthermore *INSERT BULLSHIT HERE*

But seriously please don't...
Feel free to correct small grammatical errors in my posts so that I look even better than Alexif (and delete Gambits posts we don't need posts that advocate restraint and calmness, it's THE ARMY damnit and we kill and destroy when we're mad, we blow stuff up because we do not like their skin color! (Just ask Alexif)

[CDThardass]

Guys here is my thoughts.

I am sorry if i have offened anyone.

If you have a problem, take care of it on the private message stuff that has been granted to us. i have sent PMs to some people who have taken offense to what i have said and tried to explain my point of veiw.

This is the last time i post ANYTHING that has to do with this subject.

[TheTokenGook]

Ok here's the deal. There is a lot more freedom on this board compared to others, trust me. Thanks to Sammy and his relatively open forum, we are able to say things and post things that most would not allow. On other forums, whenever that AC-130 or AH-64 video is posted, it is automatically removed. Whenever you say "Jap" the moderators automatically change it to Japanese. Fortunately for all of us, this board is not operated that way. The main reason why I chose not to delete these posts is because I can see that there are some strong opinions here. Also, if I were to remove them, they would be gone permanently. I'll leave that decision to Sammy this time.
Now, though we have a lot of freedom, there needs to be restraint. As with the privacy rules on this board are here to protect us, so are our rules for personal restraint. I don't think Sammy would appreciate us just bickering and flaming each other on his board. As I understand it, he created this site for us to discuss issues related to the Army, ROTC and to bs every now and then. Definitely not to flame each other. If we want to bitch and argue, let's bitch and argue about gas prices or how our battalions are screwing us over. So, as before, everybody just chill, and don't make everything personal.
Now everybody kiss and make up, or go find an alley somewhere to kick each other's ass.