1st USAF ADS Female Pilot

[TheTokenGook]

First chick to pilot a T-Bird will be in the #3 jet.
F-16.net (http://www.f-16.net/f-16_news_article1400.html)

[Skull6]

Lay off Fifi. She's a '96 USAFA grad & an Eagle driver...:D

[TheTokenGook]

nothing wrong with that. She's kinda cute actually.

If there's anything wrong with her, it's the fact that she flies Eagles instead of Vipers http://www.whatifmodelers.com/forum/html/emoticons/fahr28.gif

[Skull6]

One doesn't "fly" Eagles, they "drive" them.

Have you ever actually seen just how large they are up close & personal? It's hard to imagine that they are single seaters, 7 remind most more of a bus than a Ferrari.

& while those lawn darts would actually be able to fly circles around the Eagles if the Eagles drivers ever let them get close enough, I don't know an Eagle driver that's so incompentent as to allow that to happen--especially Fifi.

[TheTokenGook]

all in good joking

I've lived around Vipers since I was 5 so I'm biased. Block 50s are my fav. Aviation photography is a hobby of mine so I've been around plenty of Flying Tennis Courts also. Or do they prefer the name Rodans?
http://www.avia-art.com/godzillawebsite/g-images/rodan.jpeg ::lol::

I'm an Eagle fan, don't worry. And I know they are the best dog fighters in the world, up until the Raptor came out.

[Skull6]

I do appreciate that Vipers were chosen as the current Thunderbird airframe. There was talk at one time of using Eagles for those shows, much to my chagrine.

Vipers are the best GUN-fighters that we have. Eagles can track & shoot down from a much longer standoff many more targets with missiles--but this is still considered "dog-fighting" in some circles. It's almost a grand testiment to total stupidity to have ANY guns on Eagles--except those used in ground strafing roles, imo.

"Rodans" :D I've also heard them being referred to as "mini-BUFFs"...

[Cerebroden]

BUFF's HA!

[armynurseboy]

Vipers are the best GUN-fighters that we have. Eagles can track & shoot down from a much longer standoff many more targets with missiles--but this is still considered "dog-fighting" in some circles. It's almost a grand testiment to total stupidity to have ANY guns on Eagles--except those used in ground strafing roles, imo....

When all you have is missles you loose the ability to fight up close. We learned that lesson in Vietname when our gunless F-4's were getting their asses handed to them by gun toting MiG-19's in furbal. They actually went as far as retrofitting the Phantoms with guns near the end of Vietnam....

[TheTokenGook]

I do appreciate that Vipers were chosen as the current Thunderbird airframe. There was talk at one time of using Eagles for those shows, much to my chagrine.

yeah, that would be crazy considering the size of those bad boys. Not only are the Vipers good because of size and agility, but becasue there's so many of them. Besides, demo teams usually have the older models of the most commonly used jet they have in service. The Blues have F-18A/Bs (soon to be C/Ds) and the T-Birds use F-16C/Ds Block 32s.


Vipers are the best GUN-fighters that we have. Eagles can track & shoot down from a much longer standoff many more targets with missiles--but this is still considered "dog-fighting" in some circles.

True true. Hence it's impressive 80+ to 0 kill ratio.


It's almost a grand testiment to total stupidity to have ANY guns on Eagles--except those used in ground strafing roles, imo.

You sure about that? One word: Phantoms


"Rodans" :D I've also heard them being referred to as "mini-BUFFs"...

ha, never heard that one, but I've heard the A/B/C/D models referred to "Albinos" since the E model (Mudhen, Beagle etc...) are a different shade of gray

[TheTokenGook]

When all you have is missles you loose the ability to fight up close. We learned that lesson in Vietname when our gunless F-4's were getting their asses handed to them by gun toting MiG-19's in furbal. They actually went as far as retrofitting the Phantoms with guns near the end of Vietnam....

Wouldn't say they had their asses handed to them. That's a little extreme. The US still had exceptional pilots, and the purpoted 3 to 1 US to VNAF kill ratio is ofen misleading. Some parts of the war, particularly with the USN, the kill ratio went back up to 12 to 1. Also, much of the credited kills by the VNAF MiGs were of fighterbombers such as the F-105.

As for retrofitting, no retrofitting took place. SUU-23 gunpods were added to USAF F-4C/Ds and some Navy B/Ns, but that's not retrofitting. Later F-4 models such as the F-4E came off the factory line with a longer nose, and internally mounted 20 mm gatling gun. So no retrofitting actually. Just other forms of adaptation. Retroffiting would be more like the addition of slats to older F-4E models. Hence there were "hard wing" (non slat equipped) F-4Es and slatted ones.